Topic 3: Did Tom Robinson have to be found guilty? - Classroom 2.02024-03-29T01:57:22Zhttps://www.classroom20.com/forum/topics/topic-3-did-tom-robinson-have-to-be-found-guilty?commentId=649749%3AComment%3A1146634&feed=yes&xn_auth=noI on the other hand disagree…tag:www.classroom20.com,2017-05-08:649749:Comment:11466572017-05-08T03:13:15.030ZMuffler 9Ahttps://www.classroom20.com/profile/MufflerFaris
I on the other hand disagree that he didnt have to be found gulity. He had to because the book was taken place in the 1900s and at that time black people were judjed by the whites and on top of that the people there were pretty much the same on beliefs. Plus the book wouldnt have the same ending if he wasnt found gulity then it wouldnt have a strong point to the reference to kill a mockingbird but if he was found guilty the book would have a stronger point and a better understanding of the…
I on the other hand disagree that he didnt have to be found gulity. He had to because the book was taken place in the 1900s and at that time black people were judjed by the whites and on top of that the people there were pretty much the same on beliefs. Plus the book wouldnt have the same ending if he wasnt found gulity then it wouldnt have a strong point to the reference to kill a mockingbird but if he was found guilty the book would have a stronger point and a better understanding of the reference in the end. I see where you are coming fr…tag:www.classroom20.com,2017-05-08:649749:Comment:11466442017-05-08T02:41:02.065ZRiver 9Ahttps://www.classroom20.com/profile/riverkareem
<p>I see where you are coming from about the trial impacting the kids in a way. the verdict of the trial confused Scout and Jem and its making them come to face the fact that the world is filled with prejudices and that's where the theme of coming of age comes from. This trial showed us the process of maturing especially through Jem and how he begins to understand the way the world works.We can see this in how they treated Boo Radley, how he was such a topic of fascination and the multiple…</p>
<p>I see where you are coming from about the trial impacting the kids in a way. the verdict of the trial confused Scout and Jem and its making them come to face the fact that the world is filled with prejudices and that's where the theme of coming of age comes from. This trial showed us the process of maturing especially through Jem and how he begins to understand the way the world works.We can see this in how they treated Boo Radley, how he was such a topic of fascination and the multiple ways they tried to get him to come out of his house but after the tom Robinson trial he says, "I think im beginning to understand why Boo Radleys stayed shut up in his house all this time...its because he wants to stay inside"(Lee 304). He understands that boo isn't just a fascination or mystery but that he isnt a bad person and he is just portrayed that way because he is different from societies standards.This horrible trial helped these characters develop and grow up and teach them that the world isnt just games and fun but its also terrible.</p> I agree with you Void on the…tag:www.classroom20.com,2017-05-08:649749:Comment:11466372017-05-08T02:09:18.933ZThoughtful 9Dhttps://www.classroom20.com/profile/SaraAlmerji
<p>I agree with you Void on the point that Tom Robinson had to be found guilty in order for the story themes to make sense .What is even more is that he had to be killed in this disgusting unfair way to prove the title or you can call it the main theme of the novel '' To kill a mockingbird '' .If Tom wasn't found guilty then this proves that Maycomb town is not racist and they treat black people equally.And Atticus would not have the chance to defend Tom Robinson and be the example of integrity…</p>
<p>I agree with you Void on the point that Tom Robinson had to be found guilty in order for the story themes to make sense .What is even more is that he had to be killed in this disgusting unfair way to prove the title or you can call it the main theme of the novel '' To kill a mockingbird '' .If Tom wasn't found guilty then this proves that Maycomb town is not racist and they treat black people equally.And Atticus would not have the chance to defend Tom Robinson and be the example of integrity .Basically all of the points Harper Lee was trying to make would be the opposite.Tom Robinson had to be the victim or the mockingbird of the story in order for us to learn what Atticus was trying to teach his kids “’Remember it’s a sin to kill a mockingbird'' this evidence proves that people might not learn their lesson if nothing big happened .For example Tom Robinson the innocent good guy had to be killed in order for the Maycomb people to relieze how racist they were .</p> I agree with you Honesty beca…tag:www.classroom20.com,2017-05-08:649749:Comment:11466342017-05-08T02:03:32.169ZSweetHoney 9Ahttps://www.classroom20.com/profile/SweetHoney
<p>I agree with you Honesty because since the Negroes are treated bad and will be accused of anything i see why they would accuse Tom Robinson to be guilty. Even though he was guilty for something he didn't do, your right when you say "<span>The jury judged Tom based on what they saw and wrongfully accused him of being guilty" because since the judge was white and Robinson was black its obvious that he would say Robinson is guilty.</span></p>
<p>I agree with you Honesty because since the Negroes are treated bad and will be accused of anything i see why they would accuse Tom Robinson to be guilty. Even though he was guilty for something he didn't do, your right when you say "<span>The jury judged Tom based on what they saw and wrongfully accused him of being guilty" because since the judge was white and Robinson was black its obvious that he would say Robinson is guilty.</span></p> I would agree with you but if…tag:www.classroom20.com,2017-05-08:649749:Comment:11467252017-05-08T01:55:09.072ZOddity Egghead 9Chttps://www.classroom20.com/profile/OddityEgghead
<p>I would agree with you but if Tom Robinson was found innocent, Harper Lee would have done that for a reason and obviously the story with the theme would change. He didn't have to be convicted of a crime. He didn't even have to die. The theme don't judge a book by it's cover didn't even have to be in the book. Harper Lee could have changed the entire book by just changing the skin color of Tom Robinson. Also, those people of maycomb in the story didn't really know who Tom was and during that…</p>
<p>I would agree with you but if Tom Robinson was found innocent, Harper Lee would have done that for a reason and obviously the story with the theme would change. He didn't have to be convicted of a crime. He didn't even have to die. The theme don't judge a book by it's cover didn't even have to be in the book. Harper Lee could have changed the entire book by just changing the skin color of Tom Robinson. Also, those people of maycomb in the story didn't really know who Tom was and during that time judgment was a huge factor during the 1930s. They didn't know what type of person he was.</p> If Bob were to just sulk arou…tag:www.classroom20.com,2017-05-08:649749:Comment:11465542017-05-08T01:41:54.683Zatlas 9ahttps://www.classroom20.com/profile/atlasluna
<p>If Bob were to just sulk around for the rest of the story, any events influenced by him would cease to exist. When Harper Lee ends chapter 28 with the lines "Mr. Tate found his neck and rubbed it. 'Bob Ewell's lyin' on the ground under that tree down yonder with a kitchen knife stuck up under his ribs. He's dead, Mr. Finch" (Lee 357). The pure shock this moment leaves the reader with would be eliminated without the tension coming from Bob Ewell. The ending of the story would also completely…</p>
<p>If Bob were to just sulk around for the rest of the story, any events influenced by him would cease to exist. When Harper Lee ends chapter 28 with the lines "Mr. Tate found his neck and rubbed it. 'Bob Ewell's lyin' on the ground under that tree down yonder with a kitchen knife stuck up under his ribs. He's dead, Mr. Finch" (Lee 357). The pure shock this moment leaves the reader with would be eliminated without the tension coming from Bob Ewell. The ending of the story would also completely change, with endless alternative possible endings. </p> I disagree with you Yin Yang…tag:www.classroom20.com,2017-05-08:649749:Comment:11467222017-05-08T01:16:11.014ZOddity Egghead 9Chttps://www.classroom20.com/profile/OddityEgghead
<p>I disagree with you Yin Yang because Harper Lee didn't have to make the story have any sort of racism. Tom Robinson didn't have to be guilty and the story could have been entirely different. The story could have conveyed a different story line to the readers. What if Tom was a white man? What if it wasn't during the 1900s. On the other hand, I do agree with you on how you said there are people in the story that are close minded and only believe what they want to believe. One main thing is…</p>
<p>I disagree with you Yin Yang because Harper Lee didn't have to make the story have any sort of racism. Tom Robinson didn't have to be guilty and the story could have been entirely different. The story could have conveyed a different story line to the readers. What if Tom was a white man? What if it wasn't during the 1900s. On the other hand, I do agree with you on how you said there are people in the story that are close minded and only believe what they want to believe. One main thing is how they think of blacks, "<span>I shut my eyes. Judge Taylor was polling at the jury: 'Guilty... guilty... guilty... guilty...' I peeked at Jem: his hands were white from gripping the balcony rail, and his shoulders jerked as if each 'guilty' was a separate stab between them" (Lee 282). This is a part of the book that any white person would want to here. They don't care if he's innocent or not, they just care about having the white man win because they just want to hear that the white man is better. </span></p> You have a point there, but i…tag:www.classroom20.com,2017-05-08:649749:Comment:11465512017-05-08T01:13:36.773ZSweettooth 9Dhttps://www.classroom20.com/profile/SweettoothTahini
<p>You have a point there, but if Harper Lee would have made Tom innocent, then a possible solution could have resulted in a death because there will still be racists. If this is not true, then why did Tom end up having "seventeen bullet holes in him" as he was trying to escape (Lee 315). Anyone would understand a couple bullets, but 17 BULLETS AT ONCE make no sense at all, unless the shooter was being biased or racist or something along those lines. Also, if it was possible for people not to…</p>
<p>You have a point there, but if Harper Lee would have made Tom innocent, then a possible solution could have resulted in a death because there will still be racists. If this is not true, then why did Tom end up having "seventeen bullet holes in him" as he was trying to escape (Lee 315). Anyone would understand a couple bullets, but 17 BULLETS AT ONCE make no sense at all, unless the shooter was being biased or racist or something along those lines. Also, if it was possible for people not to go wild after a Negro being let off the hook, then why else would Harper lee make seventeen bullets so important to the reader. She is probably trying to <em>prove</em> the actions of the lives of the southerners.</p>
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<p>(this was to the part when you said that not all people are racists.)</p> To be honest, Sunset, you cha…tag:www.classroom20.com,2017-05-08:649749:Comment:11467812017-05-08T00:36:46.945ZSweettooth 9Dhttps://www.classroom20.com/profile/SweettoothTahini
<p>To be honest, Sunset, you changed my point of view. You have a point that most of the town was thinking that Tom was innocent, but didn't want to show it. I say this because during this time of history, it wasn't considered a good sign if you accepted Negros. So, if someone in the town spoke out, they could be threatened or even worse. Getting back to the point, you were right, it would have been necessary for Tom to be found guilty because it gives the actual message of the story that even…</p>
<p>To be honest, Sunset, you changed my point of view. You have a point that most of the town was thinking that Tom was innocent, but didn't want to show it. I say this because during this time of history, it wasn't considered a good sign if you accepted Negros. So, if someone in the town spoke out, they could be threatened or even worse. Getting back to the point, you were right, it would have been necessary for Tom to be found guilty because it gives the actual message of the story that even if you are innocent, you will be found guilty if you are a Negro. Like you said, in the trial when the charges were being put out, Judge Taylor was repeating "Guilty...guilty...guilty...guilty" (Lee 211). This means that, as you said, Judge Taylor was pausing in between from the grief of the voting, and the whites in the room were probably down as well because the case was stated clearly and he wasn't let off. Also, Bob Ewell was the only one that took action of any sort after the trial related to it. So, coming to a conclusion, if Tom hadn't been found guilty, then the point of the story wouldn't have been made clear. And thank you for changing my point of view.</p> I completely disagree with yo…tag:www.classroom20.com,2017-05-08:649749:Comment:11467192017-05-08T00:26:57.114ZRiver 9Ahttps://www.classroom20.com/profile/riverkareem
<p>I completely disagree with you Fairydust on how you said the story would still show how racism impacted the south if the trial was eliminated. We all knew that racism existed in the 1900's, it still happens today, how people are called racial slurs and treated badly based on the color of their skin and apart from the trial that's pretty much what happened. But the trial showed how a liked, good,clearly innocent man lost to a hated terrible one because of the color of his skin. It showed that…</p>
<p>I completely disagree with you Fairydust on how you said the story would still show how racism impacted the south if the trial was eliminated. We all knew that racism existed in the 1900's, it still happens today, how people are called racial slurs and treated badly based on the color of their skin and apart from the trial that's pretty much what happened. But the trial showed how a liked, good,clearly innocent man lost to a hated terrible one because of the color of his skin. It showed that no matter who you are, you will never be accepted or equal to the people in Maycomb, that you are nothing more than the pigment of your skin. This trial seems unthinkable to us almost 90 years later from when it "happened" but other things like a woman of color being harassed and called names walking home is still common. I like to think that in another 90 years racism will be completely abolished. Continuing on, I disagree with you saying judge Taylor has racist ideologies because of the verdict. <span>Atticus says to aunt Alexandra when Bob Ewell tries to break into judge Taylor's house, "I proved him a liar but John made him look like a fool. All the time Ewell was on the stand I couldn't dare look at John and keep a straight face. John looked at him <span>as if he were a three-legged chicken or a square egg. Don't tell me judges don't try to prejudice juries"(Lee 335). </span> Judge Taylor like many people</span> finds Bob Ewell ridiculous and did what he can do on the stand to persuade the jury. But still they reached a unanimous decision and he couldn't have ignored their decision. He was on Tom Robinsons side and tried to let the trial be fair with more than one subtle way.</p>